Pointe Fitting & How the Wrong Shoe Effects You
Hey all, I really wanted to explore further how the wrong and terribly wrong shoe fits will negatively impact the new pointe student. What if you or your daughter or your friend is dancing on the completely wrong shoe, and its the thing holding you/her back from the full potential the feet and ankles have? I know it held me back!
Tonight I took pictures of my feet in the same/similar poses in all three pairs of my pointe shoes. The pictures are surprising! Here is the breakdown of all three pairs. I took photos of the fronts/tops, first position, and the backs of all three pairs.
These are my shoes in the order I bought them left to right. The furthest column to the left was my first pair. The middle column was my second pair, and the last column is my current/last pair.
This picture is one of the most startling of all three.
Left Shoe: Grishko 2007: As I mentioned above, the picture on the left shows my first pair of pointe shoes. You can just see there is something off about them. My foot is in an "S" shape. It's hard to tell because of the glare, but the foot on the right especially is having a hard time getting on the box. There is a pretty significant gap between the floor and the front edge of the shoe.
Middle Shoe: Capezio Aria: The middle shoes were my second pair. There are no ribbons or elastics on these anymore, but even with a huge wad of lambswool in the shoes to cushion them, my ankles are sickled and very obviously compensating for the immense pain my big toes were in. Nobody should EVER be in this much pain from pointe shoes.
Right Shoe: Capezio Contempora: This shoe is my third and current pair. They aren't 100% perfect, but you can clearly see a visible difference in my ankles and feet.
Left Shoe: Grishko 2007: In this picture you can see how strangely the shank bends or fails to bend with my arch. I don't know if I just got a defective shoe or what, but this one is nothing like others I've seen on other people. The shank just does not properly support me or bend correctly. I should get a picture of these that match the other two. I just feel unstable standing on pointe in these as I can't get properly over my box.
Middle Shoe: Capezio Aria: This picture shows what my 2nd fitter saw. The shoes appear to fit me great. I should have spent more time in them in the store, perhaps I would have identified the immense pain on my big toe before buying them. The shank isn't twisting, it looks to be supporting my foot. It's a miracle my ankles are mostly straight here. I can't stand in them for more than a few seconds anymore.
Right Shoe: Capezio Contempora: This shoe twists very slightly on my foot. They are still by far the most comfortable shoe though, and usually I can compensate for that twist with my stretch ribbons and their tension. I could stand comfortably in these for a really long time.
This picture is pretty amazing too. Just look at my stance in all three pictures. You can clearly see that my stance in the left pair is much smaller than the other two, and yet I'm not fully over my box at all. It'd be closer to closing in 5th than closing in 1st.
Left Shoe: Grishko 2007: These shoes just look terrible in this view. The foot on the right of this picture is not on the box, the arch looks really wrong, my stance is compromised, it's really not good in any way.
Middle Shoe: Capezio Aria: Yet another reason to always tell your pointe shoe fitter what you are feeling in your potential future shoe. This shoe looks amazing on my feet. It is just visually stunning and very complimentary! You'd never know that the ballerina is cringing while waiting for the self timer to go off.
Right Shoe: Capezio Contempora: This shoe is almost as stunning as the middle pair, but without the pain. I'm fully over the box, my legs are fully extended properly, it just creates that really nice line.
Tonight I took pictures of my feet in the same/similar poses in all three pairs of my pointe shoes. The pictures are surprising! Here is the breakdown of all three pairs. I took photos of the fronts/tops, first position, and the backs of all three pairs.
These are my shoes in the order I bought them left to right. The furthest column to the left was my first pair. The middle column was my second pair, and the last column is my current/last pair.
**Disclaimer: Nothing against any of these brands of shoe, or makers of shoes, they
just aren't quite right for MY foot. If you try any of these on and
they fit you perfectly, awesome! More power to you!**
The Tops/Front of my Feet
This picture is one of the most startling of all three.
Left Shoe: Grishko 2007: As I mentioned above, the picture on the left shows my first pair of pointe shoes. You can just see there is something off about them. My foot is in an "S" shape. It's hard to tell because of the glare, but the foot on the right especially is having a hard time getting on the box. There is a pretty significant gap between the floor and the front edge of the shoe.
Middle Shoe: Capezio Aria: The middle shoes were my second pair. There are no ribbons or elastics on these anymore, but even with a huge wad of lambswool in the shoes to cushion them, my ankles are sickled and very obviously compensating for the immense pain my big toes were in. Nobody should EVER be in this much pain from pointe shoes.
Right Shoe: Capezio Contempora: This shoe is my third and current pair. They aren't 100% perfect, but you can clearly see a visible difference in my ankles and feet.
Left to Right: Grishko 2007, Capezio Aria, Capezio Contempora
The Back of my Feet
Left Shoe: Grishko 2007: In this picture you can see how strangely the shank bends or fails to bend with my arch. I don't know if I just got a defective shoe or what, but this one is nothing like others I've seen on other people. The shank just does not properly support me or bend correctly. I should get a picture of these that match the other two. I just feel unstable standing on pointe in these as I can't get properly over my box.
Middle Shoe: Capezio Aria: This picture shows what my 2nd fitter saw. The shoes appear to fit me great. I should have spent more time in them in the store, perhaps I would have identified the immense pain on my big toe before buying them. The shank isn't twisting, it looks to be supporting my foot. It's a miracle my ankles are mostly straight here. I can't stand in them for more than a few seconds anymore.
Right Shoe: Capezio Contempora: This shoe twists very slightly on my foot. They are still by far the most comfortable shoe though, and usually I can compensate for that twist with my stretch ribbons and their tension. I could stand comfortably in these for a really long time.
Left to Right: Grishko 2007, Capezio Aria, Capezio Contempora
The Tops/Front of my Feet
This picture is pretty amazing too. Just look at my stance in all three pictures. You can clearly see that my stance in the left pair is much smaller than the other two, and yet I'm not fully over my box at all. It'd be closer to closing in 5th than closing in 1st.
Left Shoe: Grishko 2007: These shoes just look terrible in this view. The foot on the right of this picture is not on the box, the arch looks really wrong, my stance is compromised, it's really not good in any way.
Middle Shoe: Capezio Aria: Yet another reason to always tell your pointe shoe fitter what you are feeling in your potential future shoe. This shoe looks amazing on my feet. It is just visually stunning and very complimentary! You'd never know that the ballerina is cringing while waiting for the self timer to go off.
Right Shoe: Capezio Contempora: This shoe is almost as stunning as the middle pair, but without the pain. I'm fully over the box, my legs are fully extended properly, it just creates that really nice line.
Left to Right: Grishko 2007, Capezio Aria, Capezio Contempora
Getting fitted for my first pair of pointes after returning to ballet was an amazing thing, but I had no idea what to expect, how it should feel, what was wrong. the difference between my first pair and the pair I fit for myself is night and day. I don't condone everyone to do what I did and order their own blindly from the internet. I do highly recommend that you research foot shapes, what your foot is like and how that translates into pointe shoes, and really try to become as educated as possible before you go in for your first fitting.
I can't believe the fitter put me in those first shoes.
Well, HAPPY DANCING!!! I hope you enjoyed this post, I really enjoyed writing it.
I fit pointe shoes and could not venture to answer your question about why you were fit in the first shoes. I would have to see your feet in person and barefoot. The only way to determine if a shoe is good for you is to dance in them. So, often what happens is beyond the scope of the fitter. You need to always take old shoes to your fitting and have these discussions.
ReplyDeleteIt sounds to me as though the statistics of your foot were met, but the practice of dancing in the shoes were not. Grishko is a very hard shoe. The result of dancing in them is not surprising. You could not manipulate the lower part of the shank with your foot. So, it stayed where it is and your foot went it's own way as well. The fact that you had to pounce to releve is the way a lot of russian dancers execute. I guess you could ask...which came first...the chicken or the egg? Do they pounce because of hard shoes or are the shoes hard because they pounce?
I would venture the second pair was either too wide or too square for your foot...lack of support en pointe. The third pair supports in the box better as it is tapered. If you have a longer big toe that would be a better shape for you. The twist may be gotten rid of with a wider width of the same shoe, but maybe not. Some dancers do not have straight feet when they pointe them. Sadly, that can be a worse problem when they are on pointe as they are pointing their feet when they are standing on pointe instead of lifting out of the shoes. Keep the elastic crossed and see if it works out. Also talk to you teacher about "clinching."
Hello, thanks for the comment!
DeleteI agree with you on all fronts. The thing that bugs me, is that when I was fitted for the first pair, the sole want quite bending right. The fitter said it wasn't an issue, and they were my first pair. I believed her.
During my latest fitting, I went to the shop that fit the grishkos the first time. Armed with much more knowledge about my foot type and fitting pointe shoes, I walked out with a pair of bloch serenades. During that fitting though, even after showing and telling the lady my previous shoes, she still insisted on having me try another pair of 2007's.
I humored her, and the same thing with the shank and sole happened, she thought they looked great. Im sure she probably shouldnt be fitting pointe shoes at all, but I was so shocked. I've seen her fitting work on other girls in my studio, I'm not impressed.
Anyways, I appreciate your taking the time to read my post. I have learned much more about fitting since I wrote this one.
Cheers!
Thank you so much for your post. This is what is happening to me. I just started pointe. We do 10 minutes at the end of one of the classes. At class, I've noticed I'm not getting fully onto pointe. I can see the gap in the mirror. I feel as if I'm forcing myself up.
ReplyDeleteI was also fitted in Grishko 2007, medium 3/4 shank but I've been wondering to myself if some of my problems is down to the shoe. My teacher has me just doing parallel rises but I'm sort of bending my knees as I go from demi to pointe, its as if subconsciously I'm bending my knees to help myself up on pointe.
I'm going to talk to my teacher before class on Monday and see about going and getting re-fitted. Maybe I need a softer shoes and softer shank. She did say when I wore them the first time that Grishkos are a very hard shoe so maybe they are too hard for my feet.
Thanks again for your post on this.
Hi Geraldine! Absolutely, I'm happy that my ramblings could help you in some way!
DeleteCongrats on starting pointe! It's so exciting and scary and amazing (and hard and painful, lol).
I really struggled with my Grishko 2007s when I first got them. They were also my first shoe, and I had no idea what it was supposed to feel like or why I was having such a hard time with them. I have super flexible feet and arches that are also quite strong, so it's weird that those shoes fit me so strangely!
I've done two follow up posts on that pair of Grishko 2007s, which can be found HERE and HERE that might be of more help to you.
One thing I realize now that I didn't know when I first started-- these particular shoes need a lot more breaking in by hand than any of my other pairs did. All of my other shoes have broken in very quickly by just wearing them in class. These Grishko 2007's look a lot better now that I've worked the demi pointe area almost excessively, but they still look pretty weird on my feet.
Thanks for reading!
Oh and one quick additional comment-- your teacher is right, Grishko shoes are traditionally a lot harder than many of the other popular brands. Part of the reason for bending your knees when trying to roll through to pointe could be that these shoes are Russian made, intended for springing onto point, not necessarily rolling through. I have no problem rolling through most of my other pairs, but these were impossible for me when I was wearing them in class.
DeleteThis could have been because the muscles in my feet were still weak and not used to pointe yet, or because of the way the shoes fit me.
It's very frustrating when your shoes aren't right. For me, it really made me feel as though I had no business being en pointe, because the most simple things were very difficult. If the shoes are holding you back from even just standing over the box in parallel, you will have a hard time progressing safely.
I recommend scheduling another pointe shoe fitting. Even if you can't afford another pair or don't intend to buy anything, going in with your current shoes and trying out some others to see if you can get over the box would be worth it in my opinion. Good luck!
Thanks for all the info. I read some info online from two teachers who both said a beginner needs a soft shank but those with a lower arch (thats me) need a full shank rather than a 3/4 so that could also be causing me problems. I also read that it can be the angle of the vamp that can cause problems. Mine is a medium 3/4 shank. I need to avoid any type of russian shoes. I have an idea what I need.
ReplyDeleteIts needs to be tapered, low profile, possibly a low vamp with a full soft or maybe flexible soft shoe and maybe a pre-arched model. I'm not looking for much really! I just hope I can get a pair as comfortable as the Grishkos :)
I enjoyed reading this. I come from a dancing family, so I'm embarrassed to ask them this, and maybe it just didn't come up in my time. My daughter has her father's feet. Long, skinny and "monkey-toed", but with my incredibly high arch. We have tried so many pointe shoes, she's almost too frustrated to go on. After upmteen fittings, we finally lucked into a woman that really seemed to know what she was doing. So her maybe 6th brand are B Morphs, and Momma is crossing her fingers. Anyway, my question is, what does "getting over the box" mean? The woman kept throwing that out as she narrowed the choices down. I can't remember hearing it before, but I danced 30 years ago!
ReplyDeleteAnd, again, I enjoyed your post and pictures. Very clear info!
Bonnie S.
Hi Bonnie! Thanks for reading!
DeleteSounds like your daughter has what are also called "banana feet" or "cashew feet". Are her arches super flexible too? That can be a real bummer to fit!
I actually wrote a post about what it means to be "on the box". It can be found HERE.
I'm not a professional fitter, but I've done extensive research on pointe fitting. From what I've read, people with these types of feet can be helped by a hard shank and a deep vamp, as well as high wings (or sides) of the shoe. One or a combination of these things will help keep her feet from rolling over the shoe all the time.
My Grishko 2007 Super Soft seem to have a pretty deep vamp and a surprisingly hard shank. They are so upright I can't get over the box at all. My Gaynors have a fairly comfortable vamp but a shank that's not strong enough, so I really push a crazy weird arch with no effort because my feet are so flexible.
I'd be interested to hear more about what she was talking about with her being over the box-- was she not over far enough, or pushing over too far?
Hi - Just curious what shank in Gaynors are you in?
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